yes you do or else that heel turn is unbelievable.

and he didn't get rid of them because he wanted to mind rape them, that's called sadism.
cartoonking1's avatar
It can be believable. You can't make a judgment from a first appearance. The next appearance expands on their character. Zuko from the last airbender showed no signs of being a good guy but he did eventually.

He does not know right from wrong, to him he was playing a game because that is all he knows.
I've seen reviews on Avatar and they all say that Zuko was clearly more then just a cookie cutter bad guy from the very start, that comparison fails.
cartoonking1's avatar
He still put people at risk and put his needs before other's. Vegeta from Dragon ball Z and was a heartless killer and he became an comrade to the hero's
Vageta did nothing beyond what's normal for his species.

and Zuko still just wanted to be loved and never crossed the moral event horizon, nor did Vegeta.
cartoonking1's avatar
He still killed plenty of people, innocent as much as guilty and what Discord did was bound by HIS nature as being chaotic.

Zuko sided with his evil sister and father, got Aang nearly killed, sent a hit man after him to finish the job, sent his uncle to prison. Vegeta killed a village of namakens, let Cell reach his perfect form that almost destroyed theeearth and happily let himself be taken over by Babdi so he could be strong enough to fight Goku when they should have been focussed on stopping Majin Buu. Neither of them are perfect but timeproved that there was more to them.
but again, by the standards or the shows they were in, they did not go to far to be redeemable. Discord did.
cartoonking1's avatar
Are you kidding: Vegeta had to go through the whole series until he mellowed out and admitted Goku was the better man and Zuko had to jump through some hoops before the heroes let him in the group.
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