Comment on Rundas Musings by musogato
Oh, I agree completely! I always like how Samus shows character, even though she's not much for words. A lot of times, it's the actions that say more.
Definitely! 
The Prime games are my favorites in part because of how well they -show- the storytelling and emotions rather than just telling.
The Prime games are my favorites in part because of how well they -show- the storytelling and emotions rather than just telling.What's your opinion of "Other M" then? That one can get pretty heart-wrenching at times.
I actually never finished that game. I can't remember if I stopped somewhere in the middle of the lava area or the ice area (or maybe some warehouse where a guy in a big machine tries to kill you?), but that game just made me so, so mad. The controls made me angry, the difficulty made me angry, (the fact that I *had* to use an online guide every few rooms just to move forward-- I hate playing that way.) Plus the constant narration and slow story pace... It just was not my cup of tea, at all. It *looked* pretty, and I did really like that intro video recreating the ending of Super Metroid, but otherwise it was just healthier for my blood pressure to not play it, ha ha.
I'd like to know what parts were heart-wrenching though, maybe I can find them through Let's Play videos on Youtube.
I'd like to know what parts were heart-wrenching though, maybe I can find them through Let's Play videos on Youtube.
I have three parts in mind, and these my personal opinion. Based on your game play experience, these may actually be spoilers; just to give you a warning
1) her encounter with the Ridley clone (which is the only time we see her fearful of her arch-nemesis) and the loss of a companion prior to the start of that fight. People keep ragging on the game for this reason (fear paralysis from her backstory), but they forget that the early developers couldn't do this in the early 2-d scrolling effects.
2) The sacrifice of Commander Adam in the destruction of Area 0
3) The loss of the new Mother. (If you ever get that far or see it on Youtube, you'll understand).
As to controls, difficulty, and narration, I had relatively no problems; a few of the boss fights were tricky, but that's it (again, from my pov).
1) her encounter with the Ridley clone (which is the only time we see her fearful of her arch-nemesis) and the loss of a companion prior to the start of that fight. People keep ragging on the game for this reason (fear paralysis from her backstory), but they forget that the early developers couldn't do this in the early 2-d scrolling effects.
2) The sacrifice of Commander Adam in the destruction of Area 0
3) The loss of the new Mother. (If you ever get that far or see it on Youtube, you'll understand).
As to controls, difficulty, and narration, I had relatively no problems; a few of the boss fights were tricky, but that's it (again, from my pov).
Oh my God this got really long. Please forgive me!! D:
And no worries about spoilers, I read/watched all about it way back when I stopped playing. But talking about this made me want to try it again, so I pulled up my last save. Apparently I was in the area leading up to Anthony and Ridley, so I played until the Queen Metroid fight and watched the rest on Youtube. I'll stick to talking about the story moments though since unfortunately my gameplay experience did not improve any. (that method of using missiles, man, I swear.)
1) I like Anthony, he's one of the few squad members with personality, so this was definitely one of those scenes where I'd be like "No, not him!!" However I can't really separate it from my knowledge of the ending, which just makes me smile, so I can't get sad over it. On a different note, Ridley's spooky entrance was definitely well done, and I liked the intrigue with Adam and the Deleter too. (although I'm mad that nothing else is ever said about that?? Like the Deleter was a big plot issue, why would they not give it a proper conclusion??)
As for the flack that scene gets because of Samus' PTSD attack, I see both sides of it. Like you said, showing her fear wasn't possible in the old games, and I think that's the same reason so many old enemies like Nightmare and Phantoon show up -- Sakamoto wanted to make a game with all of these memorable characters and express what he couldn't because of the old limitations. The problem comes from having it make sense in the context of the game. So many of these old monsters show up with no introduction or reason for being. As for the fear itself, I'm all for showing a character's vulnerabilities. It's compelling and can humanize them, if done right. And if this was the first or even second time that Samus had seen Ridley since her childhood, that scene would have been a perfect fit. ...But it wasn't her first, it was her fifth. At some point you just become exasperated with running into the zombie Ridley clones, right?
So, I don't know, I'm on the fence. On one hand, I get where Sakamoto is coming from, and as a writer sometimes you just want to yell "Screw the logic, this scene is awesome!" And leave it at that. But that's not really a good way to tell a story in the long run. If he had his team research and workshop the idea behind it (her having PTSD), maybe they could have created and placed smaller scenes earlier in the game that would've given more credence to her shutting down at Ridely's appearance. Breadcrumbs, you know? Or if something happened just prior to make her feel vulnerable/like a child again, so that when she saw Ridley she was still in that state of mind. Maybe even just thinking about her parents, so it at least ties in with *why* she fears/hates Ridley so much. Something to balance what Sakamoto wanted to express while still being mindful of the current situation/timeline.
2) Okay. Adam was pretty cool in this scene. The VA did a good job, and although I didn't like Adam in the beginning because I thought he was a jerk and the weapon authorization thing was really dumb, by the end of this scene I was like, "Noo, don't do it!" It's only too bad that they had to diminish Samus in the process, and never really complete their arc by having her prove herself or show that she's not the same kid as she was in the flashbacks. (Also shouldn't she be *really* concerned that the GFeds have a weapon that can completely disable her suit? I would be.) In addition, what was his sacrifice even for, really? There were still Metroids on the main ship. All of the missions he gave Samus were completed by other people or monsters, and in the end the whole ship was blown up anyway. Story-wise, Samus didn't gain anything from his death or even prove herself by finishing off Ridley or saving the ship. "Eye-of-the-storm clarity," that's what he died for. But where was her chance to use that, to show how she's grown?
3) I have no sympathy for MB. She tried to kill everyone on the ship, and then tried to launch an attack to kill even more people. Possibly all people! Yeah, no, sorry. Madeline's VA did a good acting job at the end though, so I kind of felt bad for her. On a side note, I thought it was cute that the GFed reinforcements were helping their injured comrades after the attack was over.
At the end of the day though, I can't help but feel like this is a video game version of a novel or memoir, like the kind they do for anime side-stories/drama CDs. Even the way Samus narrates, it's in a past/passive tense like she's reflecting on it or telling a friend/therapist rather than actively feeling and thinking these things in the heat of the moment. There was just too much unnecessary talking and narrating, when fewer words or none at all would have been more effective. It's like Sakamoto wanted to make a movie, a book, and a video game, all wrapped into one. It didn't work for me.
And no worries about spoilers, I read/watched all about it way back when I stopped playing. But talking about this made me want to try it again, so I pulled up my last save. Apparently I was in the area leading up to Anthony and Ridley, so I played until the Queen Metroid fight and watched the rest on Youtube. I'll stick to talking about the story moments though since unfortunately my gameplay experience did not improve any. (that method of using missiles, man, I swear.)
1) I like Anthony, he's one of the few squad members with personality, so this was definitely one of those scenes where I'd be like "No, not him!!" However I can't really separate it from my knowledge of the ending, which just makes me smile, so I can't get sad over it. On a different note, Ridley's spooky entrance was definitely well done, and I liked the intrigue with Adam and the Deleter too. (although I'm mad that nothing else is ever said about that?? Like the Deleter was a big plot issue, why would they not give it a proper conclusion??)
As for the flack that scene gets because of Samus' PTSD attack, I see both sides of it. Like you said, showing her fear wasn't possible in the old games, and I think that's the same reason so many old enemies like Nightmare and Phantoon show up -- Sakamoto wanted to make a game with all of these memorable characters and express what he couldn't because of the old limitations. The problem comes from having it make sense in the context of the game. So many of these old monsters show up with no introduction or reason for being. As for the fear itself, I'm all for showing a character's vulnerabilities. It's compelling and can humanize them, if done right. And if this was the first or even second time that Samus had seen Ridley since her childhood, that scene would have been a perfect fit. ...But it wasn't her first, it was her fifth. At some point you just become exasperated with running into the zombie Ridley clones, right?
So, I don't know, I'm on the fence. On one hand, I get where Sakamoto is coming from, and as a writer sometimes you just want to yell "Screw the logic, this scene is awesome!" And leave it at that. But that's not really a good way to tell a story in the long run. If he had his team research and workshop the idea behind it (her having PTSD), maybe they could have created and placed smaller scenes earlier in the game that would've given more credence to her shutting down at Ridely's appearance. Breadcrumbs, you know? Or if something happened just prior to make her feel vulnerable/like a child again, so that when she saw Ridley she was still in that state of mind. Maybe even just thinking about her parents, so it at least ties in with *why* she fears/hates Ridley so much. Something to balance what Sakamoto wanted to express while still being mindful of the current situation/timeline.
2) Okay. Adam was pretty cool in this scene. The VA did a good job, and although I didn't like Adam in the beginning because I thought he was a jerk and the weapon authorization thing was really dumb, by the end of this scene I was like, "Noo, don't do it!" It's only too bad that they had to diminish Samus in the process, and never really complete their arc by having her prove herself or show that she's not the same kid as she was in the flashbacks. (Also shouldn't she be *really* concerned that the GFeds have a weapon that can completely disable her suit? I would be.) In addition, what was his sacrifice even for, really? There were still Metroids on the main ship. All of the missions he gave Samus were completed by other people or monsters, and in the end the whole ship was blown up anyway. Story-wise, Samus didn't gain anything from his death or even prove herself by finishing off Ridley or saving the ship. "Eye-of-the-storm clarity," that's what he died for. But where was her chance to use that, to show how she's grown?
3) I have no sympathy for MB. She tried to kill everyone on the ship, and then tried to launch an attack to kill even more people. Possibly all people! Yeah, no, sorry. Madeline's VA did a good acting job at the end though, so I kind of felt bad for her. On a side note, I thought it was cute that the GFed reinforcements were helping their injured comrades after the attack was over.
At the end of the day though, I can't help but feel like this is a video game version of a novel or memoir, like the kind they do for anime side-stories/drama CDs. Even the way Samus narrates, it's in a past/passive tense like she's reflecting on it or telling a friend/therapist rather than actively feeling and thinking these things in the heat of the moment. There was just too much unnecessary talking and narrating, when fewer words or none at all would have been more effective. It's like Sakamoto wanted to make a movie, a book, and a video game, all wrapped into one. It didn't work for me.
(The longness is real, friend.)
You bring up several excellent points. I would like to point out a few things that may bring a bit more context as to my decisions.
For the Adam/Sacrifice scene, while there may not have been much for her to gain or prove, it's pure loss through grief that strikes a chord in me. It shows me that she's not always a badass. She's human too, and has emotions which she's occasionally subject to. Think a moment. In an instant she's lost a father figure, an excellent CO, and (my guess secretly) her closest friend despite the grudge she's held since her last encounter. How would you feel if that happened to you?
The MB? I agree. No sympathy since she's the one behind the whole thing. But at the end of the day that doesn't discount that she still was treated like garbage and no one validated her own growing emotions. Prejudice, hypocrisy, and betrayal is what she faced by peers (or people she thought were peers if they didn't backstab her). I show empathy to her in that respect. I wouldn't wish that on any one, honestly. It's a poor way to live with that heavy of a shadow.
The sidetopic of weapon authorization. I have the impression that it's more her idea rather than his to keep her abilities in check and using them on an as needed approach. It also makes for great plot points too, which is what I think the creator was going after. But also consider this: minus the tank pickups, how many new abilities were actually picked up? Out of past games it's been a quest to acquire abilities that appear and reappear with frequency. For all intended purposes, Other M comes directly after SM. Her walking in with Hyper Beam and the rest of her armament and using them off the bat? That's just unfair to the enemies. Not to mention for her getting to the heart of the matter before the story of the game unfurls to its conclusion.
For me, at the end of the day, I share your feeling of a novelized game, but what game nowadays couldn't be interpreted as such anyway? It has it's place in her history no matter how bashed it gets, it's well told, and shows players an unexpected side of her--probably one they don't want to consider.
You bring up several excellent points. I would like to point out a few things that may bring a bit more context as to my decisions.
For the Adam/Sacrifice scene, while there may not have been much for her to gain or prove, it's pure loss through grief that strikes a chord in me. It shows me that she's not always a badass. She's human too, and has emotions which she's occasionally subject to. Think a moment. In an instant she's lost a father figure, an excellent CO, and (my guess secretly) her closest friend despite the grudge she's held since her last encounter. How would you feel if that happened to you?
The MB? I agree. No sympathy since she's the one behind the whole thing. But at the end of the day that doesn't discount that she still was treated like garbage and no one validated her own growing emotions. Prejudice, hypocrisy, and betrayal is what she faced by peers (or people she thought were peers if they didn't backstab her). I show empathy to her in that respect. I wouldn't wish that on any one, honestly. It's a poor way to live with that heavy of a shadow.
The sidetopic of weapon authorization. I have the impression that it's more her idea rather than his to keep her abilities in check and using them on an as needed approach. It also makes for great plot points too, which is what I think the creator was going after. But also consider this: minus the tank pickups, how many new abilities were actually picked up? Out of past games it's been a quest to acquire abilities that appear and reappear with frequency. For all intended purposes, Other M comes directly after SM. Her walking in with Hyper Beam and the rest of her armament and using them off the bat? That's just unfair to the enemies. Not to mention for her getting to the heart of the matter before the story of the game unfurls to its conclusion.
For me, at the end of the day, I share your feeling of a novelized game, but what game nowadays couldn't be interpreted as such anyway? It has it's place in her history no matter how bashed it gets, it's well told, and shows players an unexpected side of her--probably one they don't want to consider.
Ahaha. Paragraphs, paragraphs everywhere!
Re: Adam/Sacrifice scene; Yes, from Samus' point of view it was a terrible, heartbreaking loss. But as an outside viewer, especially one who loves stories, I can't help but see the faults as well. If Sakamoto wanted people to care about Adam's heroic sacrifice, he needed more than just Samus' narrating and a dramatic death scene. This story is in part about Samus and Adam's reunion, a glimpse of their past, and what he means to her. But with this game's portrayal, it's hard to understand *why* he matters because all we really see is the negative or neutral. We never see or hear *one* pre-death scene where he approves of Samus or shows any kind of positive feelings toward her. All he has is that photo of her and Ian on his desk; everything else is Samus' conjecture. Did she spend her free time with them? Have dinner with them? Talk about life with them? These are the kind of scenes that should have been flashbacked or mentioned, to show that this wasn't all just in her head. That they had an actual relationship, and that we as the viewer should feel sad for that relationship to be ending.
His sacrifice also seems to be a callback to Ian's death, in fact the scenes practically mirror each other. One of the brothers is trapped on a ship that's about to explode, while Samus is desperate to save him and prove her capabilities, but is prevented from doing so. Nothing has changed. Samus is still treated like a child, not trusted to do what she can. If the pre-credits end scene is anything to go by, the lesson in all this was that Adam was right, and she should have listened to him. Sorry, but as a woman, I prefer stories that are a little more empowering than that.
Even if Adam had to die, it would have been nice if he at least showed that he respected her. At the end he acknowledges that she's a Galactic Savior, but he says it as though it's a slight on -him-. *He's* not a savior, *he* can't defeat Ridley, but he *can* blow up Sector Zero and save her. Has Adam been mean/neutral to Samus this entire time because he's *that* insecure?
Maybe it's a cultural thing, maybe it's a guy thing, but I would have preferred to see their relationship start off rocky and then slowly warm up, instead of being rocky the entire way through. Maybe Adam is a jerk with a chip on his shoulder because Samus left after Ian died, but then as the mission goes on, he acknowledges Samus' skills and accepts her input on battle strategies or whatever. They work together like adults with battle experience, rather than getting stuck in this old loop of commander and follower that drove them apart in the first place. Yes, Samus is a woman with emotions, but she's also a battle-hardened warrior with the fortitude to infiltrate and destroy enemy planets by herself. It'd be nice if the game could balance that view, rather than just choosing one over the other. Maybe if Sakamoto had interviewed women in the military, he would have had a better idea of how that works.
Gameplay-wise, I agree that starting a game with all available powers would be boring, but they could have found a better way than "Adam says no." There's no sense of accomplishment when an ability is authorized for use, it's just "ugh, finally." Even when they try to withhold it, like the Varia Suit upgrade, it just comes off as wrong. The best moment comes from when Samus authorizes herself to use the screw attack/shinespark, but then Adam shoots her in the back afterwards, so... I understand they don't want to do the 'it broke/aliens stole it' method like the Prime games, but still. Even -no- explanation for the missing abilities would have been better. Or, maybe her weapons malfunction for whatever reason, and she has to repair them with certain parts from the ship. You have the fun of hunting the pieces down, maybe even from bosses if they're robotic, and if the game was less linear, you could decide which weapons to fix, thus deciding which new areas to explore next! That could be cool.
Regarding MB, I never trusted her in the earlier scenes because of her creepy eyes, so her reveal only justified my feelings rather than make me feel sorry for her situation. Maybe if the game had spent more time building up her humanity rather than being a suspicious person. Or if she responded positively to being called Melissa again, rather than using it as an opportunity to try kill Madeline. However, it doesn't help that the movie "A.I." utterly destroyed me on this topic, so I'm kind of guarded on this stuff anyway. Although it's interesting Sakamoto had Samus feel sorry for MB, maybe there's supposed to be some kind of parallel between her and Samus outside of the Baby Metroid thing. Women used as weapons, then discarded when they assert their own opinions? Hm. Now there's a storyline that could have been developed more.
Re: Adam/Sacrifice scene; Yes, from Samus' point of view it was a terrible, heartbreaking loss. But as an outside viewer, especially one who loves stories, I can't help but see the faults as well. If Sakamoto wanted people to care about Adam's heroic sacrifice, he needed more than just Samus' narrating and a dramatic death scene. This story is in part about Samus and Adam's reunion, a glimpse of their past, and what he means to her. But with this game's portrayal, it's hard to understand *why* he matters because all we really see is the negative or neutral. We never see or hear *one* pre-death scene where he approves of Samus or shows any kind of positive feelings toward her. All he has is that photo of her and Ian on his desk; everything else is Samus' conjecture. Did she spend her free time with them? Have dinner with them? Talk about life with them? These are the kind of scenes that should have been flashbacked or mentioned, to show that this wasn't all just in her head. That they had an actual relationship, and that we as the viewer should feel sad for that relationship to be ending.
His sacrifice also seems to be a callback to Ian's death, in fact the scenes practically mirror each other. One of the brothers is trapped on a ship that's about to explode, while Samus is desperate to save him and prove her capabilities, but is prevented from doing so. Nothing has changed. Samus is still treated like a child, not trusted to do what she can. If the pre-credits end scene is anything to go by, the lesson in all this was that Adam was right, and she should have listened to him. Sorry, but as a woman, I prefer stories that are a little more empowering than that.
Even if Adam had to die, it would have been nice if he at least showed that he respected her. At the end he acknowledges that she's a Galactic Savior, but he says it as though it's a slight on -him-. *He's* not a savior, *he* can't defeat Ridley, but he *can* blow up Sector Zero and save her. Has Adam been mean/neutral to Samus this entire time because he's *that* insecure?
Maybe it's a cultural thing, maybe it's a guy thing, but I would have preferred to see their relationship start off rocky and then slowly warm up, instead of being rocky the entire way through. Maybe Adam is a jerk with a chip on his shoulder because Samus left after Ian died, but then as the mission goes on, he acknowledges Samus' skills and accepts her input on battle strategies or whatever. They work together like adults with battle experience, rather than getting stuck in this old loop of commander and follower that drove them apart in the first place. Yes, Samus is a woman with emotions, but she's also a battle-hardened warrior with the fortitude to infiltrate and destroy enemy planets by herself. It'd be nice if the game could balance that view, rather than just choosing one over the other. Maybe if Sakamoto had interviewed women in the military, he would have had a better idea of how that works.
Gameplay-wise, I agree that starting a game with all available powers would be boring, but they could have found a better way than "Adam says no." There's no sense of accomplishment when an ability is authorized for use, it's just "ugh, finally." Even when they try to withhold it, like the Varia Suit upgrade, it just comes off as wrong. The best moment comes from when Samus authorizes herself to use the screw attack/shinespark, but then Adam shoots her in the back afterwards, so... I understand they don't want to do the 'it broke/aliens stole it' method like the Prime games, but still. Even -no- explanation for the missing abilities would have been better. Or, maybe her weapons malfunction for whatever reason, and she has to repair them with certain parts from the ship. You have the fun of hunting the pieces down, maybe even from bosses if they're robotic, and if the game was less linear, you could decide which weapons to fix, thus deciding which new areas to explore next! That could be cool.
Regarding MB, I never trusted her in the earlier scenes because of her creepy eyes, so her reveal only justified my feelings rather than make me feel sorry for her situation. Maybe if the game had spent more time building up her humanity rather than being a suspicious person. Or if she responded positively to being called Melissa again, rather than using it as an opportunity to try kill Madeline. However, it doesn't help that the movie "A.I." utterly destroyed me on this topic, so I'm kind of guarded on this stuff anyway. Although it's interesting Sakamoto had Samus feel sorry for MB, maybe there's supposed to be some kind of parallel between her and Samus outside of the Baby Metroid thing. Women used as weapons, then discarded when they assert their own opinions? Hm. Now there's a storyline that could have been developed more.
View all replies
Wholeheartedly agree! I also love the atmosphere, the music, and just the feel of having a cool, futuristic universe that was so large!
YES. The Prime trilogy has the best music and atmosphere! I love how the different rooms are designed and textured too, especially the Luminoth decor in Echoes. I could just stare at those wall and floor patterns for hours. Same for the Chozo designs on Talon IV and Skytown. The amount of effort and artistry the game designers put into those games is always a source of inspiration for me. Whenever I get stuck in my own art projects, I just boot up one of the games and wander around, hoping to learn something from what they did. XD
Nice! yeah, I just love the art direction. Everything is realistic yet alien at the same time, and that's what separates it from other Nintendo games to me. I just love the world that Metroid has created, and I hope to see more of it!
Yeah, it's definitely in its own category. 
And yeah, I hope they keep making Metroid games. I'm looking forward to that new Federation game, if only because it may be a possible stepping stone to a new game with Samus and Sylux, if Kensuke Tanabe's E3 interview has any weight to it. (Plus it does look kind of cute and I'd like to see what kind of appearance Samus makes in it.)
And yeah, I hope they keep making Metroid games. I'm looking forward to that new Federation game, if only because it may be a possible stepping stone to a new game with Samus and Sylux, if Kensuke Tanabe's E3 interview has any weight to it. (Plus it does look kind of cute and I'd like to see what kind of appearance Samus makes in it.)
That's what I've heard! I'm excited to see Sylux again! Tanabe was saying that he has ideas about bringing it back in a new Prime installment for the NX, so there's that to look forward to!
I'm also looking forward to Federation Force. Personally I think it actually looks pretty fun. I always thought a game focused on the Federation Marines would be neat.
I'm also looking forward to Federation Force. Personally I think it actually looks pretty fun. I always thought a game focused on the Federation Marines would be neat.
Yeah! It'll be neat to see where they take that storyline. I hope it'll involve planet-hopping; space travel would look amazing on the new hardware.
I've never been much for multi-player games, I think I only enjoyed Kid Icarus: Uprising and the Mario Kart series. But I hope this game will have a demo, and I'm glad to hear it will have a single-player option as well. And yeah, it'll be interesting to see the Metroid world from the GFed's perspective.
I've never been much for multi-player games, I think I only enjoyed Kid Icarus: Uprising and the Mario Kart series. But I hope this game will have a demo, and I'm glad to hear it will have a single-player option as well. And yeah, it'll be interesting to see the Metroid world from the GFed's perspective.
View all replies